(no subject)

[maderr]

I really wish the stupid cat would come back inside so I could go sleepy x_x I wanted to be in bed awhile ago, but noooooooo. Fucking cat >.> We're gonna have stew for dinner tomorrow. Chinese stew.

In other news, because I'm tired and trying to stay awake, cracked open a torq story I'd never gotten around to reading and all it's done is remind me why I stopped reading some the med to hard kinks. I fucking hate the way so many stories do dom/sub stuff. The dom is always some asshole I wish would fuck off and die, and the subs are whiney babies I want to punch in the face and just ARGH

Mostly it's the dynamics. Such a fascinating dynamic to work with. I love it. So many stories fuck it up or lay it all out in paint-by-numbers fashion, a lot of telling but not showing so I feel more like I'm reading some sort of really shitty instructiong manual more than a romance.

Ugh. I guess I have no room to talk. That sort of thing isn't something I've really tackled. I guess I have my dwtd dragons, but I don't know if they count per se. It's a bit different, there, because the dragos are. not. human. they can look human, and act human depending on how lazy they are (Cal does really well, the twins not so much). So, I dunno. You've got Charlie (angel from dwtd) but again that's different -- Jed made him, literally. He wears a collar as part of keeping him what he is, and to show who made him, etc. I have harem, but again -- not a true play of dom/sub roles.

I dunno. Maybe it's beyond my comprehension and that's why it's bugging me. But I do know how important characters are, how crucial it is to get their dynamics right. If all you're going to do is beat me over the head with shit instead of showing me, and if you're more interested in A is Master and B is Sub and beating me over the head with THAT, then please to be going away. It can be difficult to write certain characters, oh my god do I know this. I'd like to see someone nail Dieter and Beraht, go ahead and try.

The most important thing is that the story is not about the fucking writer and what she wants to see. It's about the character, the story. How would A act? How would B act? If A did this how would B react? Would he react differently if C was around? If all you're going to do is cut out stupid ass paperdolls and force them into the situations you want to see, or worse -- change them because your'e too fucking lazy to do it right -- then get the fuck out of the sandbox.

What makes me saddest is that my words are empty. The sad truth is that it's the crap that gets published, and I can write 'til I'm blue in the face and get nowhere. No one wants details, or characters that work, or worlds that make sense. They just want tissue paper stories with lots of smut. As hard as I try, the likes of Prisoner or my fairytales or DwtD or Kidnapped just don't amount to much.

Would like to see a GOOD dom/sub story. It's such a pretty dynamic when done correctly. But that's the ultimate problem I guess -- damn near every story I read makes it ugly. It should be hella pretty. I mean come on, it's not like it would even be hard to do it properly. I mean most people take the cop out of B learning from A so A immediately throws him into the dom/sub games, regardless of what B was actually hoping to learn (which, generally, is just learning how to be a good fuck toy. the creativity, it slays, especially when there's no goddamn fucking cultural basis for anyone to be acting thi way or choosing to do this). There are much better foundations to start from. No, I'm not telling you. But I will say that old school is best school and sometimes the best place to start is with the obvious. People try too fucking hard and wind up sounding dumber than they would have otherwise.

Ugh rambling now.

Whatever. Tired. Cranky. Seriously annoyed. Cat back. Ignore me. To bed I go. Peace out.

Comments

[hyperjirou.livejournal.com]

First off, it sucks that the publishing world works that way. Unfortunately, it is true that publishers that are willing to publish slash prefer smut to plot. I look forward to the days when it's easier for slash writers like you, who really write something more suitable for del rey or Daw than the smut rags, are able to get themselves published by those mainstream companies.

On the dom/sub note, I completely agree. I can only think of one story which does it well. If you are familiar with the Weiss Kruez fandom try Miko no Da's Sinners and Saints arc. Not only does she pay a lot of attention to character interaction, she customizes the dom/sub dynamic. There is some very dark parts to the characters background, in the first story of the arc especially, but it's very much for character building. The main dom/sub pair shows up in the second story. The sub in question, was born and raised in the community, and is incapable of functioning without a master. The dom, claims him to protect him, and spends the rest of their relationship slowly teaching him how to be both a sub and a person. It's very interesting.

[maderr.livejournal.com]

I should be used to it. Lord knows I knew what I was in for when I first got into this genre. Even a beta has told me I should just give in and write something mass-pleasing just to get published (which I fucking refuse to do). Still, I do wish I could find my niche. Enough people believe me here there's got to be some place willing to take me -__-

Wow, Weiss. There's a fandom I haven't touched in years. I'll look it up sometime.

[raielchan.livejournal.com]

Do any of the doms have trouble cracking up while being dom or have a problem with being too polite?

[avalon13.livejournal.com]

Firstly,

HEY. I'm chinese. I do not eat cat stew. We find stir fry is much better and keeps the meat at a more tender and succulent texture. We also eat babies.

Secondly,

Fuck them Torq bitches. Torq is porn central and precious few of their books are worth reading. Honorbound is the only things that save it from utter and total misery.

Thirdly,

Sadly, the whole Dom/Sub thing has never been my cup of tea. It may be because I've never read a good one. I wonder, Megan...Will you be changing that? *leer*

[graphitesmudges.livejournal.com]

STOP ECHOING WHAT I'M GOING TO SAY. O____________O You have no idea how FREAKY that is.

As for the third point, >.> I've read this good Dom/Sub SMUT, but plot-wise? Eh. I'm not so sure myself.

[maderr.livejournal.com]

Heh. I could not resist the Chinese crack. I figured one of you would be amused, or at least smack me <3

Here, here. I keep trying to give them a chance, I need to learn to give up.

I'll read almost anything. Everything intrigues me, and I love seeing new stuff. There is precious little I flat out refuse to read, and I love a challenge.

Maybe? I dunno, right now I really do have enough on my plate.

[sunandshadow.livejournal.com]

I think the issue of how to do a Dom/sub story well is a very interesting one. I certainly have seen many D/s stories where I hated one or both characters and had no idea why one would see anything admirable about the other. Probably I'm biased, because the only kinds of Doms I like are the protective Daddy/Leader ones and the benevolently manipulative ones. If the dom doesn't respect and care about his sub its not love, and I only want to read about love. Yet there are so many stories that drool over Doms who are sadistic or arrogant assholes overflowing with machismo, I guess someone must find that attractive.

Its the same with submissives - I like the ones who are 110% loyal and long to be helpful, or in some cases the suspicious ones who have to thoroughly test their potential master before giving their trust and loyalty to him. And if the submissive never gets to feel sorry for the Dom and help him in some important way its not a real partnership, when the most appealing thing about D/s stories is their focus on the formation of an intense intimate partnership with two distinct complementary roles. I also can't respect a sub who doesn't have personal integrity and some hard limits that, if his Dom ever did X, he would leave the Dom, stop loving him, or maybe even try to kill him or turn him in to the authorities. If it weren't for the fact that such a story would be no fun to read, I'd want to see some stories where the Dom goes too far and the sub gathers his resolve and walks out. But it couldn't end in an apology and reconciliation because that would be a cop out, but how else do you get to a happy ending?

I do think it must be hard to write a D/s story because the writer would have to understand on a gut level both why a Dom is a Dom and why a sub is a sub; me I am neither so I have difficulty understanding both. Why does a Dom want to be the one with all the responsibility? (I get sick of having responsibility.) Why does the sub trust the Dom's judgment? (I don't trust anyone's judgment if it disagrees with my own, and if it agrees with mine that hardly counts as me being an obedient follower.) I don't think anyone has the moral right to give orders to anyone else, what would my character's moral philosophy be if he felt differently?

[maderr.livejournal.com]

Ah, see. You obviously have thought it out, something so-called writers constantly fail to do. I like what you have to say, and you say it very well -- right down to the not getting. I myself resent being given lots of orders. I don't want all the responsibility, but I don't want to entirely give it up either. So a relationship that is composed of two extremes is intriguing. I wish writers took this to mind and played with it more.

I also agree totally with the sub setting limits thing.This latest story pissed me off b/c the dom did some pretty nasty shit and the sub thought when it was all over that he might have once been fallng for the dom, but right then he hated them. A few hours later everyone is confessing and making up and all is well -__- It was fucking stupid and totally not buyable, esp. since what the dom did was really fucking close to rape.

[icytanya.livejournal.com]

To introduce meself, i'm just a pirate who's been lurking on these shores for some time and i suddenly felt very guilty about it. Specially since i can totally empathise with you! I hate bad BDSM stories (I loved your Tori/Kip one tho....)
Have u eevr been to a site called mannazone.org? It's not really a D/s relationship but it's good man- really good, it's even got an essay explaining how the relationship works which is pretty interesting though u don't need to read it to get into it. It's still one of my favorite slash sites (original fiction mostly) though the author doesn't add any new stories. And the smut is HOT! It's my fav site after urs, really love urs though...especially Toad Prince- i squeed over it first time i read it. I'll stop bothering u now! ^_^'

[maderr.livejournal.com]

Yay! I like when people delurk ^__^ I do not know that site; I'm terrible about finding other slash sites, I tend to get so caught up in writing I don't read as often as I'd like. I'll check it out, and thanks for mentioning it.

Hee, Toad Prince ^__^ I'm glad you liked. It's always fun to hear which fairytales people like.

[ruselkie.livejournal.com]

so clearly you just need to set up a paypal account, and we'll just pay you to write, since you kinda do it on demand anyway. skip the whole publishing nonsense-- authors get screwed by that anyway, right?

seriously, you have some of the best writing i've ever read (and that would be a hella lot, trust me) and if you do ever self publish (especially black magic or any and all of your fairy tales) i will be first in line with my check/cc/money order in hand.

hopefully sleep has helped.

[maderr.livejournal.com]

*laugh* I wouldn't be that crass, lordie. Maybe I'll spend the day editing, that most loathed and despised chore.

Thank you very much, my dear. You guys keep me trying and improving.

Oh, it always helps. Sleep cures all ills, even bad porn.

[sunsetbaby.livejournal.com]

I understand how you feel. Even when I'm talking to my friends they have so many misconceptions about BDSM. I really liked Ann Somerville's domination story, okay... wait... she doesn't have it on her site? Did I remember the author wrong? How incredibly frustrating... okay... I will find the story eventually and then send it to you (and by eventually, I mean, now, when I should be studying:P)

Cheers,
-J

[maderr.livejournal.com]

Somerville, huh? I hear mixed reviews about her.

[mechante-fille.livejournal.com]

Oh, let's see. I could probably write a book in response, but, break is almost over so I'll refrain. Um, highlights. Noticed a couple of people mentioned Manna's Administration Series. I plan to buy the first book, Mind Fuck now that it is out in print. The first couple of chapters of the book act as a stand alone short story, so it is a nice way to test the waters. Then if you like, there is lots, lots more. It is a future dystopia story, but not really sci-fi.^^ Imagine the European Union in a future that decides that peace is only possible with martial law, the obliteration of national identity, and routine and highly skilled torture as the way of determining truth and justice. The main characters are fascinating, and the sub is one of the strongest men I've encountered in fiction. I think you'll really like the Dom, too. He and Dieter... well, I think they would respect one another, but possibly one would end up dead.

Um, as far as Ann, I really liked her Darshian Tales. The past ones. I couldn't get into the future world setting ones. But if you were going to give her writing a shot, I'd start with Kei's Gift, if I were you.

Also, I owe you comments for the brain-melting pirate/ninja story. Mmm, mmm, good!^^

Heh, wrote a book, anyway.^___^

[sylphy.livejournal.com]

*waves* Hi!

I've been lurking around for a little bit, and then this caught my eye, and well. This kind of thing always draws me in.

It's sad that it's very true that it's hard to find a good story that portrays a D/s relationship. It's always interested me how someone would give that much control over to another person. And you're very right in saying that most are just about the smut these days. I won't go into how many times I've ranted to my friends that most people have no fsking clue about what their talking about. Heh.

I've found though, that the only way to find a really good example is to find an author who is into the scene themselves. Unfortunently it's hard to find them. I've found a few good D/s stories, but pretty much no good BDSM ones. Or at least ones that have a good solid relationship to support it.

[carib-nymph.livejournal.com]

As a lifestyle & pro-Domme (savagegoddess.com), I find it's usually that the writers don't have any real background in fetish, so they're basing their knowledge on tv-shows, movies and "what everybody knows" (which is usually wrong 90% of the time).

:p

Half my job is therapy, and my personal subs/slaves are there to make up for the idiots that pay my mortgage. But I stopped reading bdsm fiction ages ago - far too painful.

[falconer007.livejournal.com]

How appropriate! I've got my own ranting to do to, and it's about cats...or more specifically ...catmen.
Just this morning I was reading that "novel" I'd ordered on Amazon and it got me so frustrated I'm debating whether to donate it to a library or just throw it in the trash. I rolled my eyes so much I was afraid they were going to fall out. It's a slave/master story and overall it's just bad...why didn't any of the reviewers mention that it was so immature and has no plot whatsoever and that the sex is so bad it makes you cringe..? I've read stories online that are so much better than this crap and I can't understand how stories like this ever get published!! I think it's unfair to the readers who disburse 10 dollars (What was I thinking?!) and also to the many authors out there who've got real talent and who CAN write a good story with a decent plot and characters... Humph!

[maderr.livejournal.com]

oh, gods. There's a good rant. And ahahahahahaha, I think I know what story you mean. I bought that one and was so very much with the pissed when I read it. That book was hideous.

Good dom/sub relationships

[(Anonymous)]

I agree that good dom/sub relationships are hard to find.

If you are interested in reading some good dom/sub relationships I would direct you to Scribe Scribbles, particularly Scribe's story about Clive, the leather hairdresser. She writes very loving dom/sub relationships and even her characters get pissed off at bad partnerships.

[droaerion.livejournal.com]

~_~ Whenever I'm in that mood I stuck to Bloodraven. It wasn't needless, it was a great actual story, there was some angst yes, but isn't there always? Almost makes me want to go reread it but considering that I've been playing Zelda PH all week and replaying pokemon in the downtime it might do weird things to my head.

Blasphemy!

[sixpence1323.livejournal.com]

Your stories are gold, Maderr! Don't you dare think less! I don't read story for smut, or anything like that. I read it for the writing - the theme, the plot, the characterizations, the symbolism, the everything that good literature is made out of. I hate pulp.

And I would've dismissed you long ago if I had thought your stories were crap.

They aren't. Your stories are so compelling. For instance, I tried so hard to hate Sandstorm and The King's Harem because of the harem - it went against everything I believe about love. But you wrote it so well and you did such a good job... And to me, it speaks that you don't put smut in your stories - most of them. You don't degrade your stories into some trashy ass romance novel. You keep them dignified. And even when you do put it in, you don't make it random and wanton. I like that. I think you're an amazing writer. Don't ever lower yourself.

Fact is, only shit gets published, yeah. But the point is you're not the crap, the good stuff. So you should be proud! (And self-published b/c guess what? I'd buy your stuff in a heartbeat - or when I have money...)

I swear, you've got the Midas touch with writing. You can turn poo into gold.

[stoplightgodess.livejournal.com]

I too wouldst recommend Scribe. She has awesomeness in as many of her works as yours and they are highly entertaining.

[ynm.livejournal.com]

In response to your good dom/sub story complain, I pretty much have the same problem. All the author seems to do is write any possible BDSM kink into the fic, and I can't stand BDSM in general. The only thing that would make it better is if the characters can redeem the fic, which they don't as they're pretty much quite one dimensional.

HOWEVER! I have found one universe that rocks. I highly recommend 'The Administration' series for your BDSM dom/sub kink satisfaction (if you haven't read it yet). The characters have layers (gasp, the shock!) in their personality and for me, the BDSM is redeemed by the fact that they truly have such trust in each other. They have saved each others lives multiple times, you can see the change they bring out in each other as the series go on, and the setting (a futuristic era) is written out in loving detail. Go check it out if you haven't read it before.

I don't have the link with me at the moment, will post again if you like.

Other than that, I'm a huge fan of your fics, and have recommended them to another friend of mine who likes to read slash too and she became a huge fan as well. I'm sorry that you can't publish your fics professionally because the demand seems to be running in a different direction from what you normally do, but I support you and your writing style. So don't change it just coz you have to conform to certain standards to sell your stuff! I'm sure that one day your time will come.

[ynm.livejournal.com]

Found the link. Here it is! I noticed that many others have recommended this as well.

Also, Pam Nunn's Bloodraven (which she took offline coz it's been published) wasn't really BDSM with a dom and a sub, but there's quite a lot of blood and gore, torture, etc. If that's your kink, she's got a new long fanfic out, "The Devil's Own" with Cloud as the main chara with lots of mental and physical torture. Poor Cloud, his angst makes him the poster boy for more angst, as if he hasn't had enough. Also, "The Cabin" which features Wolverine and Gambit. All these have the blood, gore, torture, rape thing in it. Bloodraven and The Cabin has the theme of love redeems all so things are happier. Can't say about Devil's Own yet though.

Psst...to makes things a little better, I come recommending tail fic!! I Was An Alien Cat Toy". She said that someone brought to attention that the premise of her book was similar to a published novella, but Ann Somerville's fic was way better. I've read both and can compare. Beware of one rape scene though.