Writing pet peeve

[maderr]

Dialogue. When writing dialogue, start a new line for a different speaker, and keep the actions properly seperated. It is horribly fucking confusing when people do this:

"Did you do that?" Kevin narrowed his eyes and glared at the speaker, more than a little annoyed by the snotty tone.

"Of course I did it," he snapped. Peter stalked across the room to loom over him in that damnable way of his.

"I did't think you had enough brains for it."


Do you see how aggravating that is? Peter is speaking lines 1 & 3, Kevin speaks part 2, but Kevin is described with line one, and Peter is described with line two. To my mind, it should look more like:

"Did you do that?"

Kevin narrowed his eyes and glared at the speaker, more than a little annoyed by the snotty tone. "Of course I did it," he snapped.

"I did't think you had enough brains for it," Peter said as he stalked across the room to loom over him in that damnable way of his.


Maybe I'm the one with the misconception, maybe I'm the one totally in the wrong, and by all means correct me if I am. Maybe it's just a stylistic thing and I don't like the style. But it seems to me that you should match everything up. I have so many ebooks that do the same thing, so maybe it really is me.

Still, I find it aggravating.

Comments

[mechante-fille.livejournal.com]

No, no. You are totally right. *nods* That is less of a pet peeve for me, and more of a 'I just don't get it/want to spend the effort to get it.'

[maderr.livejournal.com]

Heh. You are, as ever, much more with the Zen. Or something.

[tsaiko.livejournal.com]

I totally thought Kevin was speaking lines 1&3, and Peter line 2. Good lord, that's terrible.

[lokiloo.livejournal.com]

;___;

[maderr.livejournal.com]

That wasn't directed at you, my dear, though I can see you are guilty. I've been rereading some of the torq books I have in print. Anyway, I'm beta'ing for you, that's way different than reading a published book that does it.

[skylark97.livejournal.com]

Hey, makes sense to me. This is why I have to read and reread everything I write, cause I have tendency to do that if I'm not careful. X_x

And that was a good example, cause in the first set, I totally assumed that speaker 1 and 3 was Kevin, and speaker 2 was Peter and the second example shows it was the total opposite. I mean, there's stylistic and then there's confusing the crap out of your readers...>_>;;

It's one of those mistakes that gets made, I'd imagine, when writers try to get away from the 'he said, she said' way of denoting speaker. Rookie mistakes that sometimes the veterans make if they're not paying enough attention...

I also don't think it's you. Some of those ebooks we've been reading make some major rookie mistakes. I've read a couple where the epithets that they come up with drive me nuts.

[maderr.livejournal.com]

Yeah, rookie stories I totally don't get upset. Man, i would hate to see alllllll the mistakes I made in rainbow ^_^;;;

Epithets. Man, I think it was your very first post that really made me notice more my epithets. I'd been trying before that, but your post of long ago really drove it home. Oh my lord does it drive me crazy. Those ebooks have some prize ones. I would love to ask the writers "wtf made you think that was a good idea?"

Though, even epithets have nothing on all the different ways to say cock.

[raielchan.livejournal.com]

No, you're 100% right.

[shattereternity.livejournal.com]

i agree...when i read something that looks like that the whole flow is disrupted and i usually end up spending a couple extra minutes trying to figure out who said/did what...very annoying

[sixpence1323.livejournal.com]

OH GOD I HATE THAT.

*shiver shiver*

Please, make it stop... make it stop...

I wish I had laser beams for eyes and I could zap everyone who does that. (That's... really weird. I know)

I also hate encountering this:

"Hello," Kaite said. "What are you doing today?" Joe asked. <- when they don't separate at all! And do it for paragraphs! Gah!

[nikerymis.livejournal.com]

::wince:: That drives me nuts. It always takes me three times to figure out who's saying what and who's doing what before I get it, and quite honestly, that's not good storytelling. If you have to focus on the words that much, it makes it hard to get into the story. At least, it does for me. ^___^

[kalldoro.livejournal.com]

Dude! I couldn't agree with you more! It seems such a basic thing to make sure your readers understand what's going on. I think sometimes some writers forget that while THEY know what's happening that doesn't mean it's clear to everyone else.

[stardance.livejournal.com]

It's not just you.

[rappleart3.livejournal.com]

so right. i really hate it when authors do that 'cause its so confusing. makes me appreciate ur writing all the more tho ^-^

[koneikaa66.livejournal.com]

understand how you feel...

[camden-rehab.livejournal.com]

It gives me a headache when people don't match up speakers with what's spoken properly...

[tsubaki-dono.livejournal.com]

Nah, that makes perfect sense. I would rather write that way too. And I to try.

[melayneseahawk.livejournal.com]

Ooh, do you mind if we use something similar to that as an example of bad dialogue for a fandom_grammar Feature?

[maderr.livejournal.com]

Not at all ^__^ Do as you please.

[acesha-coeurl.livejournal.com]

I'm good friends with an English major who grammar checks our MSN Messenger conversations. She would go nuts with the red pen on that one.

[acesha-coeurl.livejournal.com]

(oh, and on a side note, did you see my comment about cover assistance?)

[maderr.livejournal.com]

I did. I've not had my wits about me enough to make proper reply. I am def considering it.

[jolena.livejournal.com]

Dude, I'm right there with you. I get hopelessly lost in some books as to whose saying what and whose doing what. Your sentences made a lot more sense.

agreement...

[(Anonymous)]

I agree completely with you. This is one of my pet peeves, too. I took a "dialogue writing" clinic a few years ago, and the teacher stressed the importance of connecting words to the speaker. That you don't do this is a large part of why I enjoy your writing. You write clearly, and your characters are adorable.

[mailechan.livejournal.com]

How did you manage to get anything cohesive out of that? I looked at it twice before looking at your translation and figuring out what was going on.

It drives me crazy when people have one person speaking and finish the paragraph with another person like that. And although I've caught myself doing that sometimes, I try very hard not to for just the reason you cited above. Do people no longer understand why paragraphs are paragraphs?

[abraxas-life.livejournal.com]

Maybe I'm the one with the misconception, maybe I'm the one totally in the wrong, and by all means correct me if I am.

No no no, that shit drives me nuts. Always confuses me. End up rewriting it in my head as I go along, even though it makes the pain last even longer.

[scribewraith.livejournal.com]

I'm totally there with you - in my head the rule goes: if a new person is speaking, use a new paragraph and if it's not obvious who's speaking, make it so.

I like your second paragraph much better too - clearer, because I wouldn't have thought that's the way it was playing out ;)

[shiruartist.livejournal.com]

I concur.

[niravive.livejournal.com]

Dude, it's like French, only it's speaker/action agreement instead of subject/verb agreement. That way, you don't lose anyone because suddenly Kevin should be Peter, and Peter should be gagged. Thanks for that translation, btw. It makes so much more sense than the nonsense I was getting.

[miikarin.livejournal.com]

Nope, totally agree with you there. Sometimes I find the problem you mention to be one of the points that brings down an otherwise enjoyable read.

For the most part I just cross my fingers and hope for the best in figuring out who said which part.

[alice_montrose]

You're absolutely right. I mean, it's just one key and it's called ENTER. How hard can it be to press that?

In Romanian, we'd get dialogue lines instead of inverted commas. It's a bit confusing for those not used to it, and I of all people see the logic of inverted commas in English. But it also makes you clearly mark the dialogue.

Besides the aspect you've covered, there's another thing to be said here: "he said", "he snapped"... isn't one supposed to avoid doing that too much in professional writing?

[maderr.livejournal.com]

Inverted comma? Dialogue lines?

Yeah, you are supposed to stick to 'he said' as much as possible. My one teacher said it's one of those things that people sort of 'don't see' so it's not possible to use it too often. But, using other stuff is okay, so long as you don't go overboard. Honestly it just gets bloody boring typing he said/she said all the time.